The McGann Library

[scribble]

From the EZ Board Library
Gallifrey 2004 Day 3 session transcript
Author
Miz Em
(02/27/04 21:26:29)

Jason: We're not waiting for Gary, are we?

Someone: No.

Jason: I’d like to introduce to you, Paul McGann, Susannah Harker, and James Goss. And we’re here to chat about a webcast production called Shada. (Applause) Who’s heard Shada? (Looks out to audience) That’s not bad! Who’s actually seen it online as well? (Looks out again) Well, that’s pretty good! We’ll have something to talk about at any rate. Shada has a very mixed history. It was a production which was originally written in 1979 for a production back then with Tom Baker. And for various reasons, including a BBC strike, only half of it was ever filmed, and it was abandoned, the next producer (couldn’t catch name) was supposed to revive it and finish it, but it never happened. So it just sits on the shelf, getting dust, and it’s always been one of those Holy Grails of Dr Who. That eventually, someone might finish Shada. And ladies and gentlemen, that is what we did.

(Applause)

Jason: I must hasten to add that it wouldn’t have happened if it weren’t for James Goss, there at the end. (Applause) Who worked at the BBC, and provided all the food. And helped us immensely, with the one thing that really does matter, sometimes, in a production, which is money. It was done as a co-production between Big Finish and BBCi.

Paul (interrupts!): Did the BBC keep the film footage?

Jason: Yes, they did!

Paul: Have you seen it?

Jason: Yes, I have! It’s being released on video! With link narration from Tom Baker.

Paul: Only half full?

Jason: Only half finished. They did things, it was mostly done location filming, wasn’t it?

James: Yes, and some studio work and no end, it’s all beginning and middle and no end. It ended with Tom Baker going “Well, and we defeated the villain, and it was all very exciting”

Jason: Which is how ours ended!

Paul: Obviously, I’ve never seen it, but when you make a picture, you, obviously never work in sequence. Was there an end shot?

James: No.

Paul: So the beginning was recorded, but no end.

Jason: Because a lot of the… I don’t know if you remember too much about the story but most of the (something) stuff was set in Cambridge. And that had to be location filming. And the filmed without (something), it was all studio blocks

Paul: So they filmed without Chronotis then?

Susannah: Who played Chronotis?

Jason: Ooh.

James: Dennis Carey

Paul: Who played Clare?

James: Victoria Bergoyn

Paul: Victoria Burgoyne? (Seems to know who she is!)

Somebody: Do you know her?

Paul: Yeah!

Some byplay I can’t hear

Paul: When was this done?

Jason: 1979

Paul: Everyone had the big hair?

Jason: Oh yeah. There are some photographs from it that I have to show you. But the funny thing is that Lalla Ward doesn’t look any different!

Paul: No, no different!

Jason: But, the…

Paul: Sorry, you were saying…

Jason: (Some stuff) Almost from day one, I said, we’d really like to do Shada. Didn’t I?

James: Yes. (Laughter)
Jason: It took about 18 months to secure the rights and put the cast together. It was a nice cast, wasn’t it?

Paul: Nice is the word. Why was it me and not Sylv?

Jason: What? Oh, I see, why you and not anyone else? I think it was because..

Paul: Sylv being the senior player and all that.

Jason: I think it was because we wanted something fresh and new.

Audience breaks out in laughter. I think Paul also made a face at this sarcastic remark.
Jason: And of course, when we think of fresh, we think of you, Paul. Not sure about the new, but definitely the fresh. James, what was the conversation that we had, regards the doctors? Just don’t say yes! (Laughter)

James: Yes. (Laughter)

Jason: So what was your opinion then, James?

James: We did start off, obviously, saying it was a Tom Baker script but there would be no chance of Tom Baker doing it, because he’s way beyond Dr. Who.

Paul: But he would have been a great Chronotis, wouldn’t he?

Jason: Yes, that’s a good idea! Maybe that’s what we should have suggested.

Paul: Too late now, baby! (Laughter)

Jason: He might have felt proprietorial about the role. In seeing you as the Doctor.

Paul: Yeah, he would’ve done, wouldn’t he? He would have towered over me, wouldn’t he? And bullied me. (Editorial: I don’t think anyone could really bully Paul, small though he might be!)

Jason: Really? What, would you have stood up to him?

Paul: I would’ve had to.

Jason: Yeah, you would bite his knees off or something?

Paul: And stand on the box to.

Jason: Yeah, that was quite funny, you and Sylvester about the box. Because, didn’t you stand on the box for the publicity shots?

Paul: You know, McCoy keeps saying that!

Jason: That’s actually become part folklore.

Paul: Yeah. I’ve stood on loads of boxes. I’m only like 5’8” and sometimes you work with these big girls. And they’re always standing me on boxes on 2-4-6’s, you know, or they dig a little ditch for the girl to stand in. They actually do that. I got over it years ago but yeah, they did! But, the first time I was on a set, I heard one guy say “Jim, we need a manmaker!” It’s all because of this girl.

Jason: So the film made you into a man! Fair enough! I think on that note, I’ll throw it out to the audience for questions.

Guy: Having seen the video of Shada, did you keep the invisible spaceship?

Paul looked a little incredulous at this question, then busts out laughing. : - ) There’s a quicktime clip of this.

Jason: Uh, yes! We did! It is invisible, which is, uh, pretty easy to keep! Yes, the invisible spaceship is still there.

Lady: Did you chat with Douglas Adams, before he died, on this?

Jason: No. I wish I had, I know a few people who were friends of Douglas’ and I wish I’d met him. I really do. But I think he died two years before we contacted the estate, about year and a half? But at the time, his estate weren’t really aware of it. Because it was never produced, it’s not in his bio, it’s not on his list of credits.

Paul: You know, he wrote about it, then he wrote about having written it.

Jason: Oh!

Paul: Because of the sleeve notes of the CD, he wrote to say he’d enjoyed doing it.

Susannah: (She asks a question here, but she speaks very softly and wouldn’t you know, the whine started up right about here)

Jason: That’s one of the reasons he didn’t put it in his official television history, because he had re-used the ideas. Because there was no Shada as far as he was concerned. So they weren’t aware of the script, and they went “Oh really?” and couldn’t find it. So we said, don’t worry, we’ll send you a copy. So we send around this copy and they said, oh okay, fine. And they said “right, I suppose you could do this then” Actually, they were very lovely and we kept them informed because Gary Russell lives in the neigborhood. He actually did the adaption.

Paul: Adaptation.
Jason: Adaptation. Isn’t adaption American?

Audience: No…

Jason: I’m just very bad with my English. He did the adaptation, and we kept them very much informed with what we were doing and they were very happy. They’re very happy to finally see it produced and I think it’s dedicated to his wife and his daughter, isn’t it?

Paul: Are they still here? Are they still in America?

Jason: I don’t know!

Susannah: No, they live in London now.

Paul: Before he died, they had moved here.

Jason: He died in a gym here. A very sad story.

Paul: Sadly missed!

Jason: Yes. He was a genius writer. Not very prolific in his writing but certainly what he produced was quality.

Paul: What was it he said in those sleeve notes? He said he had to sort the plot out first, then try to justify these outlandish plot turns for the next few weeks. It’s a good way to work, you know? I’d like to try to get on with that. But he was very fond of it, he was really fond of Doctor Who, he took it quite seriously.

Jason: As you said yesterday we had the rehearsal, which Paul knows is unusual for us.

Paul: Yeah.

Jason: Did you enjoy that process of reading it through and getting to hear the jokes, basically. There are some real interesting jokes in there. (Laughter)

Paul: It was good. It was great to rehearse, you know.

Susannah: Yeah

Paul: Any kind of rehearsal really.

Susannah: Gives you a sense of the structure of it. And the pacing of it. (something I can’t hear) I can’t imagine not doing a rehearsal. Is that normally how you do it?

Paul: Yeah, you just wing it!

Susannah: (Everybody’s talking at once and it’s hard to hear her anyway.) So there’s no structure

Paul: Yeah, you just do it.

Jason: We hope the actors have read it beforehand, obviously. (Paul gives him a look here and laughter breaks out in the audience)

Paul: What and ruin the surprise?

Jason: Yeah (laughter. This must either be the worst recording of the three or this group just talked really softly because I can’t hear the rest of this.)

Susannah says something here…

Jason: Do you have any questions?

Guy: This is a more general question of the cast. Is BBCi looking to do more webcasts? Or that webcast would be finished that you talked about?

James: Is the question about the webcast from Richard E. Grant coming later?

Audience: Ohhhh… (Because Paul gives James a look)

Paul: Richard E. Can’t

Audience breaks out in laughter

Paul: That’s how he would say it, isn’t it? Richard E. Can’t! (makes it real nasal, real hoity-toity sounding)

A lady (Denise?): Oh, I’m telling!

Paul: Sorry! (Does not look in the least bit sorry!)

Jason: James, don’t say anymore!

Jason: But is it the case that we will work together in the future?

James: Yes!

Jason: But we can’t talk about it at the moment?

James: Yes (Audience laughs. James always has these one word answers. And the one time he had a long answer, Paul gave him a hard time. I think he stopped trying after that. Afraid to offend the talent! : - )
James: We are working on an undisclosed project at the moment.

Paul: What’s that? Are you allowed to say? What’s going on?

James: Yeah! It’s about zombies and witches and it’s very good. (after that I couldn’t hear it)

Jason: And it’s written by?

James: (somebody) Benson

Audience: Oooh!

James: (some guy’s name) looks like a giant bear! (Some other stuff) And he’s a very good writer, of course!

Jason: We’re doing (something) which is our next production with BBCi, and it’s not Dr. Who. But we have other things in the pipeline

Guy: It was written originally for Tom Baker, and I was wondering if there was much reworking done for McGann to do it instead of Tom Baker.

Jason: That’s a very good question. Gary can probably give you a better indication than me. But I think in general no, because the part was written for the Doctor and I think if you ask any of the doctors to say the lines they just say it in a different way but keeping the essential doctorness of the part intact. So, no, it wasn’t dramatically rewritten. I think there were references to jelly babies which we may have overwrote but in general no. The other thing as well is that, how do I put this, Tom Baker had the tendency to change a lot of the scripts whilst in production and because it wasn’t produced, it was the original script from Douglas Adams before Tom had played with it.

Paul: What did he do?

Jason: Well, he used to, I’m not sure I’m allowed to say, really. But he used to change things.

Paul: Just dialogue?

Jason: Just dialogue and so forth which he didn’t like and make it funnier because he was in the program for so many years and the lead for so many years.

Paul: That’s kind of understandable though.

Jason: Yeah, it is, it is. It’s what he wanted to do. And as the lead character, that’s fine. But sometimes, some of his ideas were a bit left of field, let’s say, and didn’t fit in with what the story was trying to say. The producers were sometimes tearing their hair out.

Paul: Did he write additional lines, you mean? Give himself monologues and all that?

Laughter

Jason: I can see this idea’s going through your head!

Laughter

Jason: Next thing you’ll see is this 50 minute monologue from Paul McGann.

Cheering

Jason: India Fisher will be back there saying “I’ll go make some tea, shall I?”

Laughter

Jason: Have we got a question from the Brigade at the front?

Some laughter.

Jason: Have you not seen Shada?

Some of us: Yes!

Someone: Well, it actually got me into Dr. Who, so.

Denise?: I thought it was interesting that you said you don’t have to change the dialogue or anything but I find that all the doctors are very different. Tom Baker was such a personality that it seems strange to me that you don’t tailor it to him.

Paul: I did find, actually, with Shada, that the pattern, some of the speech patterns, you know, were his. You know there was an attack to the lines. The lines were actually, the lines were longer. Because he was able to, Tom would speak very quickly, he was able to drive, he could speak in whole sentences, you know. (laughter) He could do it very quickly, whereas I, I’m not really like that. But some of them, I noticed that I would run out of breath. Jesus, this line’s still going on, you know. But he could do that.

Jason: Did you find your interpretation of the Doctor sort of changing for that script?

Paul: Yeah, a little.

Jason: That’s interesting! Because I’ve spoken to quite a few of the writers who write for us, and often they don’t know which doctor they’re writing for. We don’t say, write a story for the Fifth Doctor, you know. We say, write a good Dr Who story, give us the outline and we’ll allocate it to a Doctor. And they often write for the Doctor, not for any of the actors. So that’s quite interesting.

Paul: Yeah.

James: The big change that we did have, we were very, very careful with the script, (long dissertation blocked by the whine of the BBC digicam) was that Paul McGann’s companion was not India Fisher. And we thought, maybe we should rewrite it for India Fisher’s Charley. (some more dissertation) While it was easy to rewrite the lines for Romana into lines for Charley, Charley doesn’t have a built in laser pistol.

James: She could have! Now I didn’t say that at the time.

Jason: And I’m sure India Fisher didn’t want to be referred to as the tin dog either.

Lady: I just first heard about Shada at this con (Just where has she been?). So I wonder, is it possible to download it from the website? Is there any way you can get a hold of it?

James: You can buy the CD copy. The webcast is currently offline until June.

Jason: Is it coming back on in June?

James: Yes.

Jason: You get to download it again in June. It’s not on all the time. The CD is available.

Lady: Is it audio or video?

Jason: It’s audio, but… James?

James: The webcast is slightly animated. (laughter) Well, things move!

Jason (to Paul and Susannah): Have any of you guys seen the animation for it?

(I remember that Paul and Susannah shook their heads or said no. The laughter blocks all of this out.)

Paul: Low tech?

Jason: Absolutely! I’ll get you a copy. I didn’t realize you hadn’t seen it.

Susannah: Are they some of the characters inside the sleeve?

James: Yeah.

Susannah: They’ve kind of taken the actors who played it and done the cartoons off it? (She’s got a lovely voice!)

James: Yes, you’re right. You’re a punk.

Susannah: I’m a punk?

Jason: You were playing it as a punk, surely?

Susannah: No.

Jason: But those were the images which we used on the website. It’s quite good. Well, I’ll send you a copy.

Guy: Speaking of Tim Dark, can you guys tell some John Leeson stories? About working with him?

Jason: What was it like working with John Leeson? (Laughter because nobody had anything to say!) Actually lets talk about the whole cast, because it was a fantastic cast. We had Hannah Gordon, James Fox, and Melvin Hayes, whom I remember as being ridiculously funny. And there was you. And there was Andrew Sachs. And Lalla Ward, and Colin. There was a lot of people.

Susannah: Yeah, there was!

Jason: It was a nice starry cast to get together.

Susannah: It was a good dynamic.

Jason: Yes! It was..

Susannah: It was an unusual dynamic.

Jason: In comparison to other casts, we did have a good time, didn’t we? We jelled together very quickly.

Paul: Then again, by dint of the rehearsal we had..

Jason: Hmm, what are you pushing for now? (Laughter)

Paul: Yeah, it was good fun! We make it in this studio in Bristol, in England, you know. Actually, it was an old BBC studio, wasn’t it?

Jason: It was! It was a stupid thing where BBC actually spent 8 and a half million quid updating that studio then sold it for 2 and a half. (Laughter) I’m quite happy because we get low commercial rates, in comparison to what BBC would charge there. Yeah.

Paul: But it’s a good atmosphere, and it’s a good place to work, you know.

Jason: There’s a lot of bands in there as well.

Paul: Yeah, rock bands and stuff upstairs. But it was good, yeah, it was

Jason: Didn’t you go up and see one of the bands one time?

Paul: Well, they were friends there.

Jason: Oh, you know them already? I didn’t realize that.

Paul: Well, I live there, you see. (Laughter) Which is why you record down there.

Jason: Yeah. (Laughter) I just didn’t realize you knew them.

Paul: I know everybody. (laughter) Eventually. (laughter) You know who I like working with is James Fox.

Jason: James Fox!

Paul: James Fox was one of the reasons I became an actor.

Jason: Really!

Paul: Fantastic actor, James Fox. Years ago, at the end of the sixties, he did, you may have seen it, that English film called Performance with Nicholas Roeg, and starred Mick Jagger. I was a 12 year old, sneaking into this cinema, you know gangs of kids, we used to sneak in the fire door to watch these pictures and I remember seeing that. Yeah, James Fox, and he was magnificent in this! And it was a bit problematic as well, because it was a film about acid trips and the like, and they all did it (something here I can’t make out), he talks about it. He never worked for 10 years after that.

Jason: I was going to say that he was out of commission.

Paul: Yeah, but he was magnificent in this film. I remember, even as a kid, sitting there, I don’t why it was great, but it was so great, you know? I’d love to do that. There was this presence in this, and he looked so beautiful. And years later, I ended working on a picture with him and thought, “I’ve got to say something to him”, you know. But you see, he’s so shy and quiet. And there never seemed to be an opportune moment to speak to him. It was actually at the wrap party, it was the last day and I thought, “Come on, Paul, just say something.” And I did, I went up and spoke to him. And I said, “You were the reason I got into acting.” And he started crying.

Audience: Awww!

Paul: But he’s like that! You’d never know, if you see his films. He plays a bullet, he’s so hard and fast and fantastic. And shiny. It’s hard to reconcile with this quiet little gentle and beautiful man. Just, you know. (Something about being apropos) So, I was thrilled to work with him. And he’s great, his Chronotis was actually fantastic! A kind of dotty side of him that he rarely gets asked to do, you know.

Jason: Nick had a lot to do with casting him.

Paul: Yeah. Because James has a brother, Edward Fox, who’s more, I mean, you can imagine him as Chronotis. And Edward Fox, he sounds posher than the Queen. (laughter, he has this thing about posh people) The poshest voice in the room. He doesn’t say “Yes”, he says “eyears” (that’s what it sounded like) “eyears!” (He does this deep raspy voice) Even the Queen doesn’t speak like that. But I think, James, he kind of liked it, didn’t he?

Jason: He brought out the kindness in Chronotis. Chronotis was a criminal, until he got older. I remember coming into the studio, I was a bit late, and I remember you coming up to me and saying “A bit of a fruity cast, isn’t it?” Is that what you felt? A bit of a fruity cast?

Paul: Yeah, but good though. It was a compliment, a little Manuel.

Jason: I think what we did was cast against type. You don’t usually see Andrew Sachs as a villain.

Paul: He had a scream, didn’t he?

Jason: He had! He wanted to go further, didn’t he? We had to turn him down.

Susannah: It was quite an opportunity to go wildly over the top, for everyone.

Jason: Don’t tell me you went over the top. Did you?

Susannah: I might have! (laughter)

Paul: He was great, Andrew. You couldn’t believe that voice came out of Andrew Sachs. He’s fantastic, isn’t he?

James: I remember walking in on Andrew Sachs practicing his cliff hanger acting. That laughter went on and on

Paul: Mwahahahah. Yeah. When he practiced, he did it like a musical score. What an actor!

Jason: Obviously when you do movies, there are no cliffhangers, it’s just one long movie. Did you think, “Oh good, I get to do cliffhangers” that end of episode acting.

(Susannah laughs here. And so does everyone!)

Paul: I’ve never thought about it, till you just mentioned it

Jason: Do you like end of episode acting?

Paul: Yeah, you have to do it, don’t you?

Jason: Yeah, it’s like “I’m going to save the world NOOOWWW!” (laughter)

Paul: Are you a frustrated actor? (huge laughter here, poor Jason!)

Jason: I was a very bad actor, when I was a teenager.

Paul: Well, that’s… no impediment. (laughter)

Jason: Yes, I was a very bad actor.

Paul: Yeah, you have to do that, don’t you? When the end of the episode comes, you have to…

Susannah: Deliver

Paul: yeah, deliver it. Andrew Sachs did it

Guy: This is for Jason. Would you cast Susannah in a future Big Finish role?

Jason: Obviously, yeah!

Applause and cheering from the audience.

Paul: Something evil, something a bit more evil, yeah.

Jason: I could do that. Actually, the way she was holding on the bicycle thing, I could see the evil side of her. You know that came out. Obviously, it’s going to be evil Susannah next.

Guy: I wonder what comments Lalla Ward had to make, given that she was in the original and also a friend of Douglas Adams and his family.

Paul: Her memories of things was fantastic. She seemed to remember everything. Anyway, she’s a very brilliant person, she’s highly intelligent, and there’s a photographic memory, she was very well read, she understands the provenance of everything. She knew what drove every scene. And I hate to say this but I’m going to anyway, she kind of directed some of it. If we were pushed for time, or we weren’t quite sure about the emphasis of a particular scene, she would know. She would say “well remember that this is this and that is that”. So she was great, you know. A font of knowledge. And a lovely gal!

Jason: She was sort of affected by it. I remember, after the rehearsal, I noticed that she was a bit quiet in the hall. I went up to her and said “Are you thinking about Douglas?” And she said yes.

Paul: They were good friends, were they?

Jason: They were very good friends for many years. Yes. I might be wrong, but I think she introduced Douglas’ wife to him.

Paul and everybody: Ohhh!

Jason: And they were very good friends.

James: And he introduced her to her husband.

Jason: Oh right! I knew that happened. So they were very good friends for many years. They didn’t just stop with Dr Who, they just kept on. She was very (chuffed?) that we were doing it.

Steph (?): Would you talk about the difference acting together on stage and acting together for the audio?

Susannah: There was quite a difference, yes. There’s obviously quite a lot more to do on the stage. It was a two-hander so there was a lot more communication, a lot more trust involved. And Paul’s a bit of a winger, a self professed winger, so it was very exciting!

Jason: Are you saying he made things up as he went along?

Susannah: Yes! But I found it very exciting! I’d always worked with actors who were very careful and very analytical and it was very liberating (working with Paul). (This is edited. I couldn’t hear all of it, because she’s got a very soft voice, and because of the audience)

Jason: Was this with regard to lines or movements around the stage?

Susannah: Everything! (laughter)

Jason: You’re not aware of this, are you?

Paul: No…

Susannah: But a great actor to work with.

Paul: The right answer! (laughter) Because it’s different, you know, it’s different from working in the theatre. Chiefly because no one can see you! With audio, you’re just working with the voice. Anyway, you know, this is probably boring, but this studio is perhaps the length of, as long as this room is wide, your mike might be on your left over there, and your swain is ten yards away. That kind of thing. So, you know, it is different. But it’s the same. (laughter)

Guy: What was Sean like to work with, and if you could pick any character in the Harry Potter universe to play, who would you play?

Paul: Do you mean Sean Biggerstaff?

Jason: Whom we forgot to name! I do apologize!

Paul: You know, I liked him. I think he’s a star! He’s not very old, is he, what 22?

Susannah: 21.

Paul: So he’s got it all ahead of him. I think he’s going to do well, he’s a clever boy and he’s also a brilliant musician. So he’s got that string to his bow as well. If you will. And he’s great fun.

Jason: I hate him (something I can’t hear)

Paul: And what was the other question? Harry Potter? What could I do? That Rickman one! Yeah! What’s his name? (There was a bit here because he couldn’t hear the audience say Snape, and he kept saying Snake instead) Snakebite? Snape? I’d like that because Rickman looks so miserable through all of it. Yeah, I could do that.

Guy: Another question. Jason, have thought about obtaining the license to do Ultra Violet audios?

Jason: Funny, not until this weekend. But I have thought about it now.

Lady: Can you talk about the production process, how long did it take to record this and was it a different length or similar to the other audios?

Paul: It was longer, wasn’t it?

Jason: Yes. We rehearsed on Monday, and recorded Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday.

Susannah: Was it that long?

Jason: Yeah. It felt like it went pretty quick, didn’t it? But I think it was only three days. James, was it only three days?

James: It was actually three and a half. Because the last day they had problems, was it the disco next door?

Paul: No, it was the students, wasn’t it? Across the alley.

Jason: Someone playing the drums anyway. In comparison to what we usually do for the audios, we usually get 90 minutes done in about a day and a half.

Guy: This is for Susannah. The first time I saw you was in House of Cards which I thought was wonderful. I was wondering what it was like working with Ian Richardson?

Susannah: Well, he’s a great actor, you know, he’s a classical actor, very impressive.
So I was very much in awe of him.

Paul: Was he scary?

Susannah (laughs): In what respect?

Paul: Overbearing?

Susannah: No, no, not at all, he’s very sensitive, very fun. I loved Ian. I got to really work with him. I played his daughter in something before. So that put a different slant on what we were doing for House of Cards because obviously it had undertones. So we had adjustments to make. I’m very, very fond of him.

Jason: So you had to refer to him as Daddy?

Susannah: I did.

Jason: Did you think, “Oh, this is getting a bit dodgy”?

Susannah: Yeah, but it was meant to be dodgy.

Guy: This question’s for Paul McGann. Are you going to be in any other Hornblower movies?

Paul: We talked about this yesterday. Only if the star, Ioan, is free to do it. He did a pilot and it was picked up and he’s here in some series now, playing some lawyer guy. He’s living down in West Hollywood and having a great time. We did them every two years, the Hornblowers, and so we’re due to make one now, this spring in England. But it’s not going to happen because Ioan’s away. I saw him yesterday and asked him about it. And he said it was touch and go, it might not happen. Also due to the woman at A&E, whose name escapes me now. Delia Fine (after prompting by audience). May lose her job or maybe move sideways at A&E. This is what Ioan said, she was our champion, if you like, at A&E, the next incumbent may not like it. So we don’t know. But I hope so, I really, really hope so. And I know that there are still a couple of books outstanding. And I want to lose a leg! Bush loses a leg, gets married (not really!), gets his own ship. I want all that to happen.

Denise: Just to stay off topic for another minute. On a related note since this is your last panel, would be please be so kind as to oblige the Hornblower girls among us and go into Lt. Bush mode for just a minute and give the command to Fire?

Paul: (He says something here that the laughter in the audience garbles) Shall I? I don’t need the mike then, do I?

Susannah: Do it!

Denise: Please!

Paul: That’s just a big shout, right? Okay, (You can see him switching to Lt. Bush) “Fiyah!” (about busted my eardrums on the headphones!)

Audience: A lot of hooting and hollering

Paul: I had a movement there!
(This is where audio only is really frustrating, because I remember him making a lot of faces)

Audience: More laughter

Jason: Obviously a very well rounded character as well. A truly fine performance.

Denise: Thank you!

Paul: It was a pleasure! It was a pleasure! (he also mouths something to Denise that I couldn’t make out in the video clip)

Guy: Would you tell us a little about working on Queen of the Damned, especially working with Aaliyah who is now deceased?

Paul: I was on that only for, maybe, ten days in Melbourne, Australia, and I met her, because she was around the hotel and on the set when I was there. I didn’t know who she was, I didn’t realize that (couldn’t hear this), my kids knew, who she was. But I met her a few times, she was great, sweet, clever, and funny. I didn’t even realize she was an actress when I first met her. Just met her around the hotel and she was lovely. I did my stuff in just three or four days including the concert footage. I was there when they did that stuff in the desert and she was on stage. But she was around, and Stuart Townsend was there. I just liked her, she’s very young as well, 21, 22, and a tragic loss, I think. Really talented. It was only later on, when my kids, you didn’t know who she was? You know, they’d play the records and yeah. Sadly missed. But yeah, it was good, a good opportunity. It was a strange picture to work on, I remember. It was a bit of a shambles, I think. The atmosphere was quite shambolic (is that really a word?) It wasn’t a lot of fun. I remember it was quite tense. Sometimes they are, you know. I’ve worked on big things, bigger things even, and sometimes, you know, it can be smooth, and I guess it depends on the director and the assistant, they’re kind of responsible for the atmosphere. I just remember on that things seemed unnecessarily tense. But she was lovely, and just glided through it. I wish I could’ve been on it longer. I’d never been to Australia, either, and, I was curious about that. I loved that place.

Jason: Which part of Australia were you in?

Paul: It was in Melbourne. And there was the desert. We were talking about this yesterday, there was a sequence, the concert sequence was mounted, they needed a 20,000 crowd, and they advertised for three or four months, you know, for sort of goth punks for a few hundred miles away to come. And they all turned up, and they put them in these huge military tents around it in the desert. It was great! It was an event!

Jason: Did you feel a bit out of place, because you were in a tweed coat and glasses?

Paul: Yeah, I thought about it. I felt a bit of a spare part.

Jason: Did you think “I’m a goth, I can do this!”

Paul: I felt a bit of, whatever the word is.

Jason: Spare wheel.

Paul: Spare wheel, yeah. Felt a bit middle-aged. No, I did.

Me: Would you come to the Chicago TARDIS convention?

Paul: Yeah, I want to go to Chicago, yeah! Because Jason knows the Chicago convention quite well. India also sings its praises. When is it? October November, isn’t it?

Jason: November.

Paul: Yeah, I might give myself a birthday present.

Applause.

Paul (to Jason): Because you’ve said it was good, haven’t you?

Jason: It is, it’s a fantastic city! (Something about Navy Pier)
Paul: What’s that?

Jason: I’ll tell you later. (laughter) It’s a pier in the middle of the city (it’s really not, it’s on the lake!). It’s gorgeous (yes, it is)

Paul: Yeah, I’d love to go to Chicago.

Susannah: Can I ask a question? I’ve always been curious about it. Why has there never been a female Dr Who? And will there be? Or will that completely break the mold?

Jason: Well, Joanna Lumley played a female Dr Who in the comic relief skit on Dr Who.

Susannah: Oh, did she?

Jason: Yeah. Actually, Gary, over there, probably has a better idea. He’s the former editor of Dr. Who magazine.

Gary: It was suggested as a joke by Tom Baker once, and ever since then everyone’s gone “That’ll be a really good idea, a female Dr Who” but no one’s ever seriously sat down and thought about it. We did an audio with Annabella Weir in it and I thought she did quite a good job but I don’t think anyone’s ever going to do it on TV.

Susannah: It’s too much of a leap, is it?

Gary: Yeah, I think people would go “No, that’s a different program”. Create a good program for a good strong woman character, but I think the BBC is always going to go “No, Dr Who’s got to be a man”.

James: Although the thing that had Richard E. Grant in it, we did have a list of women as possible people to cast as the doctor.

Gary: Who did you have, James?

James: Alas, Margaret Rumford is dead! I honestly can’t remember. I think that Kate Winslet was one of the names.

Paul (incredulous): Kate Winslet?

Laughter from the audience

James: Penelope Keith, it was just

Susannah says something here

Jason: I can see Penelope Keith in a frock coat.

Paul says a name here

James: It was just the most randomest names.

Gary: Who would you want to have play it.

Susannah: Someone said Maureen Littman had been very keen on playing Dr Who. Is that right?

Gary: I’d never heard that, but she’d be very good

Paul: Kathy Burke. She’d be good.

Gary: We asked Kathy to do one of our audios. And she said no.

Jason: She was brilliant in Elizabeth, she played Queen Mary.

Paul: Kate Winslet! (He couldn’t seem to let that go)

Gary: We’re with you on that one, Paul.

Guy: This is for Paul. Have you ever considered asking one of your brothers to appear in one of the Big Finish audios?

Jason: What a good idea!

Paul: No, I hadn’t. But if I did, what could we get them to do?

Jason: I don’t know!

Paul: You know, before we started out as actors, before we’d been on TV, before we were well known, we used to sometimes cover for one another. It was possible to do that then. We were fairly interchangeable.

Some byplay I can’t hear.

Jason: Paul, you’ve grown!

Jason: Do you sound alike?

Paul: Yeah, we do!

Jason: Oh!!

PMEB: No! (They really don’t!!)

Paul: You hadn’t thought about that, had you? Even more if the meter’s running. Yeah, it’s possible. Mark could fill in.

Jason: So have you done jobs where one of you has gone to the audition and got it, and can’t do it, and someone else has just turned up and “Oh, it’s McGann, right”

Paul: Yeah, that’s actually happened.

Jason: I’ve got a friend who’s a twin, who’s an actress and the only difference between her and her twin is a mole. And she does do that, she puts the mole on, and goes and does the job. We’ve got to keep a better eye on him, aren’t we?

Paul: When we were teenagers we had our girlfriends going, “Now, which one am I going out with?”

Jason: Did any of the brothers say “Take her off my hands, go on”

Paul: Let’s not go there.

Laughter.

Lady: How close in age are you and your brothers

Paul: Four years between us, between the four of us.

Lady: Any twins?

Paul: Actually, I had twin brothers. They just lived a few days. They were born in 57, they’d be 46 now. So my mum had seven children, six boys.

Lady: And where are you in the… Are you the oldest, youngest?

Paul: If you count the twins, I’m the middle child. They have this thing, don’t they, about middle children. I’m second of us. Joe’s the eldest, he’s a year older than I, then it goes one year, one year, one year.

Lady: Now that you’ve worked with Lalla Ward, and of course, with India all the time. If Jason said to you, we’re going to bring in a new female companion, what would you want as your dream companion.

Paul: I just think that whoever it is, personality wise, I think she should be his equal. So in that respect, more of Romana. It strikes me that it works better, he needs to have an equal. He needs somebody to… I don’t think he patronizes Charley at all. I think whoever it is she should be able to hold her own and stand up to him and haul him by the scruff of the neck sometimes. Somebody strong. Just a preference. And gorgeous. (laughter) And, um, rich.

Jason: Stand on a box?

Paul: Yeah, stand in a ditch. But not Kate Winslet.

Guy: I’d just like to thank Paul for coming out (applause)

Paul: I have had, a blast! You’ve made us feel very welcome, and it’s been great. And I look forward to coming back next year. (to Jason) Are you coming back next year?

Jason: Oh yeah! We come back every year.

Paul: It’s been great, because, I mean, it’s only been the second time I’ve ever done this kind of thing. But it won’t be the last, you know. Because it’s been great, the atmosphere (huge applause here) and the spirit has been fun, so… I’ll see you at the next one, whenever the next one is.. Chicago! My kind of town!

Jason: And on that note! Thank you very much!

Paul: Thank you all!

Applause
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"Listen carefully. This is the secret of how to live: fire your gun before somebody else does." ~ Scribble, Vurt